Ignoring history won't make the problems disappear

Sure, it sounds good to just say: “let’s solve this with the free market” , but the fact is that this mentality holds no tangible evidence that the free market can be considered a solution. However, there is plenty of evidence to confirm that in time of crisis, relying on ‘free market’ solutions has led to widespread social problems and further economic problems – argentina, chile, poland, russia.

Talking points helpful to opposers

The idea that the markets can regulate themselves is only rational in the world of Leave it to Beaver.

Ethics have been thrown out the window in favor of maximizing profits and beating out the competition. Even with all the regulations we have in place now, they continually find every loop-hole and technicality that allows them to manipulate the system to their advantage.

The problem is greed.

3 opposers found this helpful.

the free markets made this happen and now they want government money. let them fail.

1 opposer found this helpful.

Recent activity on this talking point
suga-shane earned 1pc because opposers found Ignoring history won't make the problems disappear helpful Wed Aug 12 10:42:14 -0700 2009 Comment
Faux Outrage marked Ignoring history won't make the problems disappear helpful Wed Aug 12 10:40:39 -0700 2009 Comment
James Atkinson marked Ignoring history won't make the problems disappear helpful Thu May 07 19:12:33 -0700 2009 Comment
ziglet1 marked Ignoring history won't make the problems disappear unhelpful Mon Apr 06 19:58:04 -0700 2009 Comment
BrentDD marked Ignoring history won't make the problems disappear unhelpful Thu Mar 26 14:54:50 -0700 2009 Comment
BrentDD posted a bulletin Thu Mar 26 14:54:12 -0700 2009 4 comments
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BrentDD (endorses) Thu Mar 26 14:54:13 -0700 2009

“However, there is plenty of evidence to confirm that in time of crisis, relying on ‘free market’ solutions has led to widespread social problems and further economic problems – argentina, chile, poland, russia.”

—Ignoring history won’t help anything anywhere.

—free market solutions have not really ever been tried, because in times of Crisis the radical socialist liberals have always been there to take up the cause that government needs to intervene. Look at Argentina, Chile, Poland, Russia, USA – When crisis hits, the revolutionary radicals are there to start feeding…

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suga-shane (opposes) Wed Apr 01 00:56:50 -0700 2009

Sorry bud, your history is a bit muddled there. The “radicals” you point to are indeed free-market fundamentalists, every one of them – be it Pinochet (Chile), Yeltsin (Russia) or the IMF, free market ideas have been tested and continue to fail. If social liberals had any real power in these countries would their main industries be privatized? Would wealth be concentrated in the hands of 1% of the populations, with sometimes upward of 40% of the rest living below poverty lines?

There has been a clear indication through time that every attempt to enact free-market fundamentalist policies (starting with Chile and Pinochet in 1970s) has necessarily subverted democracy. A prime example is Boris Yeltsin’s outrageously violent takeover of the russian legislature after the fall of the wall – when Russia was a fledgling democracy, Yeltsin engineered the military coup with the aid of the IMF, World Bank and Washington, and russia effectively went from communist to democratic and right back to dictatorship. This was all to enable free-market reforms without the worry of public support because the military was on hand to quash any public unrest from economic malaise on the part of Yeltsin’s policies.

The few examples where yes, socialist/communist leaning parties were in power before free-market reforms (Poland, South Africa) can be traced to IMF and World Bank loan agreements. Upon securing control of governments in democratically held open elections, Solidarity (poland) and the ANC (south africa) were forced to repay the debts racked up by massive military spending by previous oppressive governments (apartheid National party in SA, soviet friendlies in poland). To rectify these debts, and continue to govern their populations, these socialist governments were forced to accept the terms of IMF loans – which always include privatizing state owned industries and utilities, removing price caps and subsidies, removing wage control and protection and disbarring unions/removing political power from unions. These are very real examples of free-market reforms subverting democracy, and each of these examples is a horror story of economic misfortune for the people living under the reforms.

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Hawkeye Wed Apr 01 06:30:25 -0700 2009

Thank you suga-shane, Read much Naomi Klein?

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suga-shane (opposes) Wed Apr 01 11:09:18 -0700 2009

Oh yes, i first picked up Shock Doctrine and could hardly put it down. As well, the Nation runs articles very frequently on this subject and they have recently published some great articles relating to the crisis we are in now.

The matter which gets me worried the most is the trend laid out in Shock Doctrine, whereby a disoriented in the midst of crisis becomes victim to “structural adjustments” or “economic reform”, considering that we may be witness to such an attempt to “free-up” our market. Luckily though, we haven’t yet seen any attempts by Obama (but really this would be the work of Summers, Rubin and Geithner) to go over our democratic processes to enact such ‘reforms’. However, this G-20 meeting this week should give us some more insight into any sorts of tricks that may be pulled…stay tuned!

nordwind marked Ignoring history won't make the problems disappear helpful Wed Mar 25 16:24:10 -0700 2009 Comment
simplecj posted a bulletin Wed Mar 25 16:10:27 -0700 2009 Comment
suga-shane marked Ignoring history won't make the problems disappear helpful Sun Mar 22 12:34:12 -0700 2009 Comment

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